Topic: Second thoughts about Apple

Well, never having missed a chance to attack Apple,  I have to reluctantly admit that they have some good points.  smile
I still think they're as evil as MS, but they hide it so much better.
My wife decided it was time that her old iBook was replaced, and decided to buy an iMac.  So:

Firstly, looking online I saw that Apple offers you a personal shopper--it's free, you just call and say you'll be at the store at such and such a time, and they hook you up.  So, I went a bit early--this is the flagship NYC store, and was quite crowded--it's a holiday weekend in the US.  There were greeters, all very nice, and one just chatted with me as I waited for our personal shopping assistant.  (His name is Mike, and if he ever comes across these forums, thank you again.)

He was extremely patient--she was undecided about several things--those of you who have shopped with significant others are probably aware that to many women, shopping is a sport.   He never lost his patience or his niceness.  I added a gig of RAM, Applecare (which has become about $100 less expensive than it used to be) and she decided to add a wireless keyboard.  As the copy of Mac Office we have is rather dated as well, we also added the Mac equivalent (though it doesn't have a mailer--which is good in my mind, I dislike Entourage, which goes for for about 80 dollars, iWorks.

Mike demonstrated iWorks to us, and my wife felt that it had some features she definitely wants.   It's apparently compatible with all Office formats, which can be important--the old Mac Office sometimes made things that were incompatible with something or another, it once cost her a job interview.   It also has the ability to export to PDF, which I don't think Office got till 2007--or maybe it was 2003, I don't know. 

OpenOffice of course, has had that for awhile.

So, when I went to set it up, I was looking for trouble and things to criticize.  I opened the keyboard and mouse and saw no battery--of course, I said to myself, it's Apple, they won't include batteries--except that they did, it was under another thing in the box. 

So, in looking on how to migrate her old stuff, googling indicated you needed a firewire cable.  Again, I thought I had them--sheesh, I said to myself, one has to either buy a firewire, or copy it over the network without making use of the migration assistant.  Wrong again--during setup, while using the migration assistant, you're given the option of using standard ethernet cable or wireless. 

The machine itself is nice.  It's not user serviceable save for RAM upgrades, but on the other hand, we've had to send in machines at work, and everything is covered.   

All in all, I had to say I was very impressed.  They've come a long way from Jaguar.  (Actually, towards the end of the iBook's life, I put Tiger on it, which was an enormous improvement.)

I still think they charge too much for the Airbook--as Mike pointed out to her, it's meant as a second computer.  I was going to do the RAM upgrade myself, but my wife said that she trusted them more.  Of course, I muttered--I only put RAM in servers costing 5 times what this cost, so, what would I know?  On the other hand it was a good thing--if, by some chance one of the RAM modules was bad, it would have been a pain in the neck.

So, anyway, I have to take back many of the bad things I have said about Apple.  The product and its presentation are quite impressive.   

She's been playing happily with it ever since, only punctuated by exclamations of "Come look at this, it's really neat."  (Hrrm, that's the best translation I can give of "Sugoi," in this context---cool, super, impressive, all that good stuff.)

By the way, I suppose most of you know that unlike our beloved BSDs, it's a genuine certified Unix.  smile

<@andre> i would be so much more efficient if i wasn't so stupid

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

I'm glad you had a good experience, scottro!

the one criticism I have is that you didn't upgrade the RAM yourself smile. Apple overcharges a LOT for RAM upgrades (at least for notebook memory).

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

There was no charge for their putting it in.  They charged $100 for the RAM, but honestly, at that point, I didn't feel like hunting around for the best deal on RAM.  Plus, then it has to be ordered, you have to hope it's good, etc.  She and I discussed it and it was the type of thing where if, for any reason, it hadn't worked perfectly, it would have been a song and dance, so, I didn't argue.  (It was her money anyway.)  smile

Looking around afterwards, I saw the same thing for about $70 less (before shipping and probably taxes), but I am an experienced married man and said absolutely nothing about it.

<@andre> i would be so much more efficient if i wasn't so stupid

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

I don't like Apple either, for starters I don't like their hardware.
Apple hardware is overpriced, and come with all sorts of restrictions, as you already mentioned you can't service your own machine, and if Apple services your machine they will keep the old ("broken?") parts, and they can even put second-hand refurbished parts back in (And considering the price of those parts...).

By the way, I suppose most of you know that unlike our beloved BSDs, it's a genuine certified Unix.  smile

The only different between certified UNIX and non-certified UNIX is large sum of money paid to SUS.

Trust me, I know what I'm doing.

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

scottro wrote:

I still think they charge too much for the Airbook--as Mike pointed out to her, it's meant as a second computer.  I was going to do the RAM upgrade myself, but my wife said that she trusted them more.  Of course, I muttered--I only put RAM in servers costing 5 times what this cost, so, what would I know?

I wonder if women married to accounts don't let them add? Mine does the same thing and I try to explain to her that I maintain machines that are in the 6 digit range but I still get the look.

"An educator never says what he himself thinks, but only that which he thinks it is good for those whom he is educating to hear."
-Nietzsche

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

That one merits an AOL ROTFLMAO. 

The reason is that I know someone married to an accountant--she was talking about their taxes, and making an appointment with the accountant.  I should mention that her husband does VERY well as an accountant and is apparently a very good one.

She said, "Are you kidding, I wouldn't trust him with our taxes."  Despite the fact that an extremely wealthy company has him as the CFO....

Today, I told the story to my co-worker, including the comment that had something gone wrong, say a bad stick from Crucial or whatever, how it would have gone.  He said, "You did the smart thing."

<@andre> i would be so much more efficient if i wasn't so stupid

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

The two words that save a marriage: "yes, dear."

Some things are not worth fighting about.

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

True!

"An educator never says what he himself thinks, but only that which he thinks it is good for those whom he is educating to hear."
-Nietzsche

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

I like my Mac Mini from a hardware point of view (the second one more than the first one... the G4 is a bit sluggish); I got tired of Mac OS X though. It just doesn't adapt to the way I want to use my computer. But then, fortunately, the Mac Mini also works very well with systems other than Mac OS X smile

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

Carpetsmoker wrote:
scottro wrote:

By the way, I suppose most of you know that unlike our beloved BSDs, it's a genuine certified Unix.  smile

The only different between certified UNIX and non-certified UNIX is large sum of money paid to SUS.

I thought exactly the same thing. I'm sure any of the BSDs would pass certification, but the cost to get certification would be a waste of financial resources.

...it's always about money...

"UBER" means I don't drink the coffee... I chew the beans instead
             -- Copyright BSDnexus

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

I always used to say that too, but remember, this is my apology to Apple thread.  smile
(However, see the first or second line of my first post, that I still believe they're evil at the top.)

As Shakespeare wrote, "What's in a name?"

<@andre> i would be so much more efficient if i wasn't so stupid

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

scottro wrote:

As Shakespeare wrote, "What's in a name?"

Some think Francis Bacon actually wrote that..but hey.

Since Scuzzo not around someone has to post these kinds of things.

"An educator never says what he himself thinks, but only that which he thinks it is good for those whom he is educating to hear."
-Nietzsche

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

Maxlor wrote:

I like my Mac Mini from a hardware point of view (the second one more than the first one... the G4 is a bit sluggish); I got tired of Mac OS X though. It just doesn't adapt to the way I want to use my computer. But then, fortunately, the Mac Mini also works very well with systems other than Mac OS X smile

i want a mac mini for the size and design. but it's just too overpriced for the parts. sad

Re: Second thoughts about Apple

Apple has flaws like any company.  From an end user perspective, there are many advantages to purchasing a Mac.  I've  had good luck with Mac hardware.  My wife and I together have owned 7 Macs since 1999.  Only one of them had to have service for a bad LCD.  It was overnighted there and back. 

The downside to apple is found when you try to use them in a business or education scenario.  Mac OS is the most inflexible operating system I've dealt with.  My current job is administering Macs for the computer science department at a university.  We're all Mac except for two dells acting as servers, and a few old dells for special projects.  We have not been able to migrate to Leopard due to the lack of flexibility with authentication.  In order for us to operate, we must allow all students to login with an account provided by the university (Novell edirectory).  We found a mapping that worked for older versions, but Leopard changed that.  I've also had problems with NFS.  One of the dells is running FreeBSD because we couldn't get the xserve (OS X server 10.4) to use NFS with another xserve + xserve raid.  FreeBSD handled it without any problems.  So instead of using one of three xserves we have for the webserver, we had to use a beater dell precision workstation.  I actually enjoy working on the FreeBSD machine, because once it's setup it just works. 

I fear that apple will not fix Leopard, and move on to 10.6.  I still think apple makes good hardware, but they need to spend more time on QA with their software. As good as open source software is, I expect a lot when I'm buying something.